A little over a year ago, we spoke with Larry Longstreth, the founder of the comedy team Bull Crank, a crew of filmmakers devoted to making comedy in the form of animation and live action short films. This time we’re speaking with a different Larry; a more mature and hopeful Larry, along with his long time partner Aaron Longstreth. With this interview we hope to see what they’re up to and why Bull Crank is no more.
Hey Larry, so what’s been happening wih you and Bullcrank since we last talked?
Nothing. Technically speaking, “Bullcrank” (or Bullcrank.com) is dead… and I’m smiling.
Can you tell us about “The Wimp Whose Woman Was a Werewolf”?
I can tell you that it’s sort of being treated like “The Greatest Fan Film of All Time’s” ugly little brother. Everybody is dying to see “Fan Film” and they don’t mind watching “Wolf” too.
Why do you think that is?
It’s so hard to get our live action skills up to par… especially in Ohio of all places. To make a good cartoon… it needs good writing, good voice acting, and good animation. Of course that’s simplifying things but that’s the basic truth. That means that Jake and myself both have to do good work. With live action, it’s different. It needs a good sound man, a good camera man, charismatic and talented actors and actresses, good directing, etc. It’s a totally different bird all together. The cartoon requires one or two guys to have their “A” game. The live action short requires about 20 people to do the same. It’s a much harder beast to conquer.
I hear there are some celebrities who came on board “The Greatest Fan Film of All Time.” Can you drop some names?
Oh, a few… but with or without the celebrity help, the cartoon would still be just as strong.
Without a doubt. You know I’m excited.
Former WWE wrestler Michael Manna, who wrestled under the name of “Stevie Richards” and who has become a good friend to Aaron and I, will be voicing Daredevil. I don’t feel comfortable flashing his name all over the place because I never want it to come off like we’re using him. He’s got the same interests and we’ve been speaking for years now. Our Lady Peace lead singer Raine Maida is voicing Guardian. Again, he’s a close friend of Jacob Drake’s, not just some celebrity we tried to contact.
Paul Molnar is voicing The Joker… which makes the comic nerds super excited. Any fan film dorks will know Paul’s acting work as the Joker in “Patient J”. Of course, he worked with us on “Wolf” as well. We had also spoken to James Gunn, the director of “Slither” and the writer of both “Scooby Doo” films but it never panned out. He was willing but we would have had to have found a place in Studio City and we weren’t willing to do that. I spoke to actor Dian Bachar as well, through a mutual friend, but he was afraid of the Union rules and all that. I don’t think he quite understood the script either. At the time, it was a series of notes because I want our cartoons to be mostly improvisation. He’d seen “Batman’s Gonna” and “Blow Pop” and thought they were great but I think the format for “Fan Film” sort of scared him off.
Would you describe “The Wimp Whose Woman Was a Werewolf” as horror comedy or strictly horror?
Definitely a horror-comedy-thriller. It’s a multi-genre short, much like “Harvey Daggit” was before it.
What was it like working with Al Tuskes and Paul Molnar?
I know the golden rule is to lie and say everything was perfect in these interviews, but that doesn’t sit well with me no matter who reads this and yells at me for what or what not to say. I don’t regret working with ANYBODY I worked with on these projects and the truth should have no bearing on how people see these guys. They are good guys. For the record, Al barely even worked with us. He just prepared actor Nick D’Amico’s makeup each day. I will just say that working with new people, not just Al or Paul of course… they were two of MANY new people, but working with new people was an enormous learning experience. It came with it’s nice surprises and not-so-nice surprises. It came with happy days and miserable ones. But.. you live and learn.
Like I said, I don’t regret having worked with anybody. If anything, working with some of the professionals we’ve worked with on BOTH projects has been either an inspiring or really scary glimpse at things to come. It reaffirmed my ambition, but it also reaffirmed the fact that I need to be who I am and not who the pros tell me to be.
I’d rather keep my integrity and be hated than throw it away and have my ass kissed by people who don’t know me. Obviously, the bigger issue with moving up toward Hollywood or toward any “bigger” platform anywhere else is a deeper one than we have time to get into here, but we’ve seen glimpses of what can happen if you’re not careful. Hell, even my friend Michael Manna (Stevie), who is extremely successful, has taught me some stuff just by some of what he says. His stories sometimes make me disappointed or depressed, but they don’t scare me away. If anything, they help you toughen up before going in.
Did you have trouble uniting the Bullcrank crew for either film?
Getting the gang together has always been pretty easy. Like any other team, I simply throw the Thundercats symbol or bat signal up into the sky and within moments, my team has gathered around me.
Seriously though, rallying the troops is easy when a film is being shot. It’s when a film is NOT being shot that it’s harder to get some of them to do anything. I can’t get angry because it’s not their love or dream, but I do get annoyed with certain people who talk as if they spend every day of their life working on films when they really just focus on their own life and job until Larry summons them. I think that, in a way, if you really want something… you don’t wait for somebody else to let you off your leash. You don’t let reality stop you, no matter how hard it tries. Kids, no insurance, no money, and busy schedules are great reasons not to do something you’d like to do… but when it’s something you feel you need to do, then they aren’t reasons. They’re obstacles… excuses. If it’s a real dream of your’s and you really want it, not one of those things will stop you from accomplishing it. After all, life doesn’t stop for anybody so you have to make time to accomplish your goals. It’s not like my life froze, bills stopped coming, and I stopped aging at 21 years old so I could make films. Sadly, all those things keep going and I make time anyway.
I think, more than anything, I have this dream of working side by side with hard working best friends and family but I’m not sure how realistic that is. They have to want it for themselves… and more importantly, they have to be willing to go get it without waiting for me to lay the groundwork or organize everything for them before handing over the reins. Some of them are doing it but most of them aren’t.
Was “The Greatest Fan Film” a long process for the crew?
Well, there was a lot of “stop and go” for one. Jacob was trying to work on his own original project and “Fan Film” at the same time. He finally shifted all attention to “Fan Film” for whatever reason.
After that, it’s simply been a long, long, long, very long process. He’s working hard but he’s going it alone. The occasional would-be helper has offered their services but they usually never actually finish what they set out to and it ends up being Jake animating alone again. I damn near kill myself trying to find ways to help and sometimes I’m able to, but never to the extent that I wish I could.
It’s one man animating scenes with tons of characters in action sequences with super powers and fx all over the screen. It’s also going to be somewhere between 20 and 30 minutes long. That’s a lot of work for one guy. So, originally we thought we’d be done by January, 2008… then March, then Summer. Now, it’s December or else because we’ve set a release date. We’ll do whatever we must to make that happen. After this, he never animates alone again if I have my way. Visit JacobDrake.com and show the man some love!
And what has the general reaction from fans and friends been to the trailer?
Everybody is basically crapping their pants and whining about having to wait so long for its release.
Me Included. Where will it premiere?
DailyMotion.com has asked for the video exclusive, which is fine by me. They would basically promote the Hell out of it and it could only be seen on their website for the first 2 or 3 days. Aimee Carlson, the young woman in charge of things like that, is a big fan of our work and has been really helpful. I think she worked for iFilm.com before whatever happened to that once-great website happened. It’s funny because not that long ago, you had to pay money to show your films on the internet and they got a lot more views. Now, youtube comes along and everybody can upload anything. It really watered the whole concept down when you’re just as likely to see some 8 year old “video blogging” about the last episode of pro wrestling or some Star Wars dork swinging a plastic light saber as you are to find a well-made, quality short film.
As far as the wait goes for “Fan Film”, it will have been well worth it. When I was a kid, it took FOREVER for that next “Zelda” game or “Ninja Turtles” movie to come out… but when it did, you worshipped it and totally forgot about the time spent waiting.
Not to sound cocky, but I really wouldn’t be surprised if this cartoon was the biggest video on the internet upon it’s release.
Larry are there any plans to work with Troma again?
Not necessarily. I’m working on an animated project that asked if I could get Lloyd Kaufman involved. I’m not sure how serious the offer was or if it will really happen but I’m sure the old man and I will rub shoulders again sooner or later. Hopefully sooner, as he’s in his 60’s and probably only has a few years of fart jokes and moderately attractive topless girls left. I think if Lloyd were a lot younger, we’d have probably worked together on a regular basis. He may not have the same taste that I do, but I definitely try to borrow from his never-say-die attitude and that “go, go, go” mentality he has. No whiny bullshit, insecurities, obstacles, or inconveniences can stop that man from doing what he’s doing. No matter what people say about it, there’s a man who would die for filmmaking. Not to get off subject, but I work a flooring construction job where sometimes you’re forced to bust your ass for 12 hours or more in a day. I feel just plain lazy when I don’t try to relate that work ethic to filmmaking, something that’s considered softer or easier. Lloyd definitely has that drive and it’s an admirable quality.
Shifting the interview to brothers Aaron and Larry, often times interviewers ask dumb questions about method and I’ll do that too. What’s your method or ideology to filmmaking?
LARRY: To me personally, my method is simple. If it feels right, do it… but always look at it without bias and objectively. Other writers, producers, friends, cast and crew, whatever… they will all tell you sooner or later what you should be doing with an idea. On “Wolf”, I made a few people angry when I wouldn’t allow them to fire blanks on set because we didn’t have a safety guy. Now, the gunshot looks perfect thanks to special fx and we never fired a shot. Artistically speaking, I could have pitched the “Nintendo: Oldschool Revolution” idea to a few friends and cousins I know and they would have shot it down and brutally told me that it wouldn’t work or wasn’t any good. Still, deep down I knew it was so I went with it…. and the rest is history. I’m not always right by any means, but I have faith in myself to a ridiculously abnormal extent when it comes to making these calls. Sometimes being a leader means disagreeing with everybody else around you and still getting your way. Without the confidence, you’re screwed because other people are making your decisions for you… sometimes indirectly. “To thine own self be true”.
AARON: It sounds corny but I think it’s just to keep things simple and to take the high road every single time. To have fun and keep the bullshit from a typical film set off of our own. I can only speak for myself even though I’m sure Larry agrees with it, but I grew up thinking working on film must be the best job in the world. As you get older, you see that that’s not always the case. Not because it’s not fun or exciting, but because some people have found a way to take the fun out of it. Some people have found ways to dumb down the most fun job in the world and make it seem like just another boring occupation.
It will never be like that on one of our sets. If somebody’s a pain, we don’t need them. Period. We want everybody to want to be a part of what we’re doing and have a great experience doing it.
If you could work with anyone in Hollywood, who would it be?
LARRY: That’s a weird question because my favorite talents are probably Spielberg or Paul Newman, but I don’t know how I would ever work with them or in what capacity. They are so far out of my league at this stage that I wouldn’t know what to do. I guess if I could pick somebody I’d love to work with… I’d say Ricky Gervais, hands down. To me, he’s simply one of the most brilliant entertainers on the planet… up there with Groening. I honestly think that Gervais and Merchant would love our sense of humor and fit right in on our projects. I will never forget Aaron showing me a dvd of the BBC version of “The Office”.
It was the first time I saw something and thought “Oh my God. Somebody else has our sense of humor. They got there first.” Of course, the American version of the show followed and taught us all that American networks and studios weren’t brave enough to fully embrace the honesty and reality of the original show. They sprinkled in sappy drama and over-the-top love stories to hold the viewers’ hands and they made the funny characters act like cartoon characters. It became clear to me after watching Steve Carrell act like a total spazz that there were still doors that needed opened here in the states. Guys like Christopher Guest, Matt Groening, Merchant, and Gervais have started it… but there’s still a long ways to go before everybody in the room gets the joke. Then again, maybe that’s what makes the joke so funny. Maybe you don’t want the audience to know you’re actually making fun of them and not the characters.
AARON: I don’t think there’s any single person. We’re not the type to get star-struck but I’m really excited to work with Adam West after his work as “Batman” and in Family Guy. I think once he’s on board, he’ll blend right in with our crew, if it all pans out of course. If I had to drop some names I’d say Wes Anderson, Christopher Guest, and the regular actors from both of their crews.
I remember watching “Best in Show” and being mad about how Christopher Guest had brought our humor to the main stage. Obviously it’s not our own as if we created it but they beat us to the punch. Still, I’m a fan.
Were there any legal disputes over the characters in the movie?
AARON: Not that I know of but hopefully there won’t be.
LARRY: It’s a tricky subject though. We’re not making a dime off the properties so we’re mostly in the clear… but in a way we are distributing them. I’m not worried about this. There are fan films out there with celebrities that have gotten away clean. If somebody wanted to bust a fan film for legal reasons, I don’t think a flash animation would be at the top of their priorities. Why gun for a cartoon made on some young guy’s computer when there are $30,000 live action fan films out there with celebrities and merchandise you can buy online? Of course… if anything DID happen… as Jacob has said in the past… he’s in a wheel chair and does not see himself as being above playing the “wheelchair card”.
AARON: Everybody in the world can use those creations but the minute you turn around and try to make money off of them, good luck. We obviously can’t sell “Batman” or “Fan Film” but that doesn’t stop it from being a perfect way to share our sense of humor or comedy style.
I do think “The Greatest Fan Film of All Time” will be our last fan film.
LARRY: It has to be. Where do you go from there?
Is Bullcrank considering shopping “Greatest Fan Film of All Time” at comic cons?
AARON: I don’t know anything about “Comic Cons.”
LARRY: I’ve been asked to make appearances or show our stuff at these things so many times but I never felt right putting too much promotion into a “fan film”. It’s something that Aaron and Jake are welcome to do if they want to pursue it, but when a film is done and available to view, my focus shifts to the next project almost immediately. I like it the most when festivals or cons say “Hey, we want to show your movie. Is that fine?” and all I have to do is say “yes” and they do the rest. I prefer to let word of mouth or fans spread our films around. This is 2008. You don’t need to mail tapes and dvds to every festival or convention any more.
Have either of you ever considered making documentaries?
LARRY: I have. There is one I would LOVE to do. Being friends with Michael Manna and having read so many WWE autobiographies, I think that pro-wrestling needs an honest behind-the-scenes documentary on the morale of the wrestlers today. Not something like “Beyond the Mat” that spends have the time kissing Mick Foley’s ass with an extremely melodramatic narrator exaggerating everything onscreen, but an honest-to-God tell all story from the wrestlers’ point of view. I don’t think any promoter would allow it but I know that I would love to work on something like this.
They always get this sort of attention when wrestling is in the middle of one of it’s popularity booms but the down periods are completely ignored by the media until something newsworthy happens. Now is the time to hear what the people in the business really think.
You can even go back and watch that old Bret Hart documentary. The one they filmed while he was leaving for WCW. It’s just so one-sided and edited to make Hart out to be this glorious hero. I think if you really educate yourself on the situation through books and other documentaries, you learn that he was sort of being an asshole. So were the guys on the other side too, of course… but a documentary about Bret Hart is not going to let him be seen in a negative light. I think that’s bullshit. If you haven’t seen it, watch it. Sound bytes are edited and moved around. There’s one part where Hart’s wife says something along the lines of not trusting Vince or Shawn Michaels, as if they are foreshadowing the events to come. If you watch, she is CLEARLY not even moving her mouth where the lines are dubbed. It’s dirty filmmaking and it makes me upset even thinking about how crooked the trade really is sometimes.
I would have an absolute blast doing a documentary on something like WWE or TNA that let me work without a bunch of suits looking over my shoulder. Not some lame ass attack on steroids that pretend they are the reason a pro athlete kills somebody. That’s just more misinformed bs. I’m talking about getting the TRUTH out of members of one of the most bizarre professions of all time.
I think it would be one of the most informative, entertaining, and interesting things people have seen in a very long time. Some of those guys are just plain miserable and we watch them on TV and think they must have it made. There are so many politics and forms of bs going on. It’s really an untapped venture that sooner or later somebody is going to bust open and make a lot of money off of.
AARON: If we ever made a serious documentary I think it’d be something we’d both have to really believe in and really want people to see or hear for whatever reason that may be.
As of now my answer would be maybe someday but not in the near future. Overall I think documentaries are overly artsy and often have too many of the filmmakers’ points of views laced throughout the facts. I think it’s completely irresponsible and misleading.
I think documentaries serve a purpose if done right but are much funnier as mock documentaries, especially for indie filmmakers because they allow you to get a way with a lot and hide your weaknesses.
So, as a fan I’m very curious. What happened to Bullcrank.com?
LARRY: Oh boy. I knew this was coming.
AARON: Bullcrank.com is dead. (scoffs) I only say that because I know it bothers some of our guys. Dead. DEAD. Never coming back. Dead and dead.
LARRY: It had about four different web designers volunteer to make it great and along the lines of what I wanted. Each of them has a story about how they were just about to make it happen when I took it from them and tried somebody else, but the truth is that I never got the results I wanted. I paid for that website for 2 years and even spent a couple hundred dollars on VBulletin, some wacky software one of them convinced me I needed. Never used it once.
It sounds cruel but anything short of ambitious is a waste of time when it comes to our films. Anything mediocre, half assed, or on the back burner needs to be replaced or dropped all together. I couldn’t pay a web designer because I personally wasn’t making money, and a lot of money-hungry people will make comments about that… but the fact is that we do what we do because it’s what we love, not because it pays. At our level, there are plenty of people with something to prove and the motivation and drive to do it. I made the mistake of passing it around the fire, giving everybody a shot. I should have just learned web design myself or never started it in the first place. We don’t need a website. I want to be about more than just popular internet videos. I’m moving forward and I don’t need a Bullcrank or Bullcrank.com to do that. Don’t take that the wrong way. My friends are still my friends… it’s just time to separate the talkers from the doers. Everybody needs to pull their own weight. It’s not right or fair for me to create a “roll call” for 10 people if only 3 of them are actually working on films.
AARON: But seriously our website was supposed to be a way to showcase our talent and films and chat with anybody who wanted to learn more about them. However, it was a headache from day one and we couldn’t keep a webmaster because apparently smoking pot was a popular thing among them. That’s a joke but seriously they never did any of the things they said they would. All and all we had three of four people who tried running it but for one reason or another it was always a headache.
However, we must have a core fan base and some regulars because we later found out that the Bullcrank.com domain name had been purchased 6 months before it expired, meaning somebody really wanted the site. That means as soon as we had decided to renew the site, it had been taken by someone else. Who bought it we have no idea, but turning negatives into positives is what we do and this is just another example of that.
What’s next for the Longstreth brothers?
LARRY: So much stuff. We’re wrapping up “Wolf” and “Fan Film”. Most of all, we’re planning for the premiere on December 13th in Kent, Ohio. Aaron and I will be co-hosting a local Cleveland TV show sometime in November and we’ll be doing countless other interviews and promo spots.
On a personal note, things are going great for me. I’ve been asked to write a feature script for Mark Ordesky (exec producer of “The Golden Compass”, “Lord of the Rings”, etc) and he and I have been going through the process step by step for a month or two now. He has taught me so much but in a weird way. It’s that sort of way where he’s probably only saying things that are common knowledge on his level, but to me they are foreign and mind blowingly new. I call him my “Yoda”, since he basically showed me that I had absolutely no idea what I was doing writing a script in the beginning. He sent me the book “Save the Cat” and read a mess-of-a-script that was 125 pages long and damn near unreadable before walking me step by step through what I needed to do to turn it into a proper draft. He’s been incredibly patient and helpful. Best of all, it’s a script I’m proud of on a personal level because it reflects the way I feel about everything in general. It’s a fantasy… a Lord of the Rings or DnD type setting… but with a character who struggles to find the right thing to do when he’s constantly put into situations that force him to choose the lesser of two evils. I’m very excited about it and I have a lot of faith that it could be something special some day.
Also, I’ve been asked by an indie producer to write a pilot for a cartoon to be pitched to “Adult Swim” and “Comedy Central”. It’s to be written and animated in the same style as “Batman’s Gonna Get Shot in the Face” and “The Greatest Fan Film of All Time”, but with original characters and stories. At first, I tried to figure out how to make this interesting for myself, but I finally settled on a group of heroes that I knew were gold. Jake won’t be animating alone, either. He’ll be heading up a team of animators. I’ll probably be wearing more than one hat as well, most likely voicing one of the lead heroes. A few celebrity names have been mentioned as being available or interested, from Adam West to WWE wrestlers Batista and Rob Van Dam. I’m sure working with them would be great, but if I had my way (I probably won’t) I’d keep the cast similar to our other stuff. I’d much rather work with Aaron, Stevie Richards, Marisa Tomasic (“Wolf”), and the old “Batman’s Gonna” gang but that’s all for selfish and stubborn reasons. I can’t deny that having Adam West would be AMAZING but until it happens, it’s all just talk.
Over all, doors are opening and I’m being put in contact with big names and opportunities on a regular basis now. How hard some of these people work and how hard I feel I need to work to be on their level.. those are the sorts of things that made me look around and realize that it was wrong to surround myself with people who didn’t care (or at least, didn’t care nearly as much) and ask for their opinions on things that had such a huge effect on my life. My dream is and always has been to have a core group of friends making films together, but whether or not that happens is no longer just up to me. It’s up to all of us. You get out what you put in… but you HAVE to put in. I carried the load for a long time and my greatest fear is that I’ll refuse to keep doing so and it will one day be said that I abandoned my friends. I would never do that. Nothing is more important to me than hanging on to what I know is important, but I know it’s not right to do things the way I have been. So, it’s time to be a true friend and meet the others at the top, where we can all some day work on films together.
For years I have flirted with the idea of making a feature, but I just don’t know anymore. Making “Wolf” was a living Hell that taught me that we don’t have this huge, amazing team of diehards. It took a year and a half to make a short film. The idea of a feature scares me to death. It’s going to happen but the more I learn, the more I want to learn before jumping in. One thing’s certain, though. I’ve been doing this for almost 8 years and haven’t made a dime but from the way things are going, that’s going to change real soon.
Aaron and I haven’t told anybody, but we’re considering sort of returning to our “roots” and doing a TV show similar to our old “Eyeball Papercuts” format. We’re so much better than we used to be and we know we could make a living at it at least for a few years until we wanted to do something else. It would allow us to keep doing our own personal projects as well. We’ll see where it all goes but for now, there are no immediate plans for the crew and it will stay that way until AFTER the premiere. It’s time to sort of stop, survey our surroundings, and figure out which way to go.
AARON: I don’t think we have any idea and frankly we don’t have time to think about it or speculate. I do know that all of our focus is on the premiere for “Wolf” and “Fan Film” and putting together an amazing show.
For now, just focus on our upcoming films: “The Wimp Whose Woman Was a Werewolf” and “The Greatest Fan Film of All Time”. Both will be premiering some time at night on December 13th at DailyMotion.com and other video websites, but if you’re in the North East Ohio area, you can witness the premiere in person! It’s Saturday night at 8pm at The Kent Stage on East Main Street in Kent, Ohio.
If you’re in the area and want to come out for the weekend, I promise it will be well worth it. It will be an amazing show and people are coming from all over the country to be there. But as for what’s next, I think the general feeling is that something really big is coming but we’re not committed to anything after the premiere as of right now. I don’t anticipate that changing.
We kind of want to go with the flow and keep all doors open. We’ll go from there.
Our thanks to the Longstreth brothers for agreeing to a follow-up interview. Look for both films coming very soon.